[Yosef Goldenberg]

Hello everyone. Is this the first discussion on the new site?

I teach forms and analysis for beginners. The teacher of a parallel group uses Russian terminology and theory, and I see that we are not at all matching, e.g. what he teaches as “phrase” is more-or-less equivalent to Caplin’s “basic idea”; and for him “period” need not have a structure of question and answer. I have noticed that in Schoenberg too – examples for “period” include cases that fit Caplin’s “inverted period” /Webster’s “anti-period”.

I have access to Russian textbooks on form – Tulin, Mazel, Bobrovsky – but I hardly read Russian. I ask for direct references with page numbers /example numbers – 1. Succinct definitions of phrase, period and sentence (if available); 2. Examples of open periods. I have found modulatory periods called “open periods” – this classification is worth rethinking! – but I look now for open but non-modulatory periods. [not including modulatory periods].

I am also interested to find out specific German sources of this terminology.

Thanks in advance

Yosef Goldenberg

[Ellen Bakulina]

Hi Yosef, indeed this is the first discussion, thanks for posting!

I recently explored the Mazel/Zuckerman textbook _Analiz muzykal’nykh proizvedeniy_ (Analysis of musical works), Moscow 1967, so I’ll give you some things from there. One good place to start is the section titled “Period,” which begins on p. 550 of the edition I have. For details, see three levels of hierarchy, from big to small: predlozhenie (=sentence, which is like the German Satz: both are used in the sense of the periodic antecedent and consequent), fraza (phrase), and motif. All this is introduced on p. 550. “Sentences” (predlozheniya) are described more closely  on p. 551. On 552, a long discussion of the motive begins. A motive can have only one strong beat (I think this comes from Riemann). Together with the motive, they also mention “intonatsiya” (intonation), p. 562.

P. 563 is where the phrase comes in. A phrase has two strong beats (that is, two measures), so it’s typical to have two motives in a phrase. I think this is where your colleague might have borrowed the concept of phrase that you are describing: it is essentially synonymous with Bill Caplin’s “idea” (like basic idea and contrasting idea). M and Z also say that “old textbooks” (I don’t know what they are!) call the phrase a “dvutakt.” Dvutakt means two measures.

Hope this helps! I’ll be curious to hear other answers to Yosef’s question

 

• This reply was modified 5 years, 8 months ago by Ellen Bakulina.

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